2004-06-27 07:24 pm (UTC)
Sometimes you are the asshole
i'm always the asshole,..
but you make a sound and well voiced point,..Bravo!,..:)
Thank you. Some of this applies to us, a lot of it hopefully doesn't.
We have been whining - in our own head if nowhere else - that we can't buy all of the CDs that we might want to. We're taking this as a timely reminder that in this case not doing what we arbitrarily want *is* the victory, and we should be proud of not buying the CDs. Tis a step forward.
Everyone whines now and then - one of the the points of journals is that we get to whine. It's the whining that is accompanied by complete inaction or actions that clearly are designed to make oneself or the people around one miserable that make me wanna smack somebody.
Recently I've been devoting a lot of time to making my own personal world a better place. It took me way too long to understand that the only person who could make things better was me.
Good writing, good point. Two thumbs up.
The victim mentality was first brought home to me in college when a friend - who came from an intact family, and had travelled all over the world, was bemoaning how miserable her life was because her father was strict and her mother was needy and she was fucked up by her fucked up parents (who I knew, and who were actually pretty nice people). When I pointed out that this didn't mean she had to keep pursuing relationships with assholes she glared at me and snarled, "You wouldn't understand what it's like to have a hard childhood."
I grabbed her by the shoulders, looked her straight in the eye and growled, "Look at me and say that again."
To her credit, she went sheepish and said, "Okay, yeah, I guess you would." But it was still years before she finally got it.
You are so very eloquent. And so very correct.
Wow, aren't you a compassionate person?
Yes there are whiney journals but you've really gone full blast over situations that may truly be out of people's control.
It's a cycle I see you and your husband do constantly, and I may get bashed for this -- but I see a lot of 'get over yourself' 'get over it' no compassion, no sympathy, no pity.
Yes, it's great that you two have near perfect lives -- but I think there is a responsibility for those of us with good lives to offer hands up, as well.
I've seen you do it before, with your sister. You kicked her in the ass, yes, but you also helped, on your own terms.
This is the lesson I learned from my recently deceased relatives, and friends in need/with serious illnesses, if we're going to play it that way.
And life is too short for some other things, too, like for me to get worked up over something like this. But I had to put my POV out there.
Maybe I'm just another selfish one, too. Ah well.
I am compassionate, and I do help people, and I have sympathy for those who are struggling with tough situations. I'm not talking about those people, I am talking about the ones who whine and moan but will do nothing constructive to change their situation, and claim that they are victims.
Maybe it's because I was the beaten, abandoned, abused child - and wouldn't allow my life to be defined by that - that I eventually lose patience with people whose litany of misery never changes because they never do anything to help themselves.
This was not meant to be a universal condemnation of people who are struggling with a tough time, only an expression of my frustration for the ones who will cling to victimhood at all costs.
Wow. I had to go back and re-read my last few entries. I know I can be a whiny, self-centered bitch, but I was just checking to make sure I haven't been lately. Whew!
Naw, not you. Don't worry! ;-)
I've recently made it a point not to write about my immigration status in my journal where anyone can see it anymore. I'd got tired of my own voice on the subject and I'm sure everyone else had as well.
We all need to vent though and sometimes I have to whine a little just to get it out of my system and move on but you are right, the 'professional victim' never gets anywhere.
Oh, hell, I have my whiney, bitchy, cranky days. Everyone does. But yeah, "professional victim" is a good way to put it.
This it the official Dweezil "gee, I wish I'd said that" post of the day!
you don't win anything.
Actually, this is just between you and me...
I will treasure my non-prize forever.
Heh. You beat me to it, sort of. I have a suggestion for the people who read my Journal that MIGHT help them to cheer up a bit. But it isn't written yet ;).
You're very sexy when you get like this BTW. Hehehe.
Teehee! You and Ferrett think the same way. He called just after I posted it and I read him a paragraph. He said, "Wow, what a turnon!"
2004-06-27 07:52 pm (UTC)
Very well put! Thank you for putting into words the thoughts that run through my head on a weekly basis as I read through my friends list.
It also brought to mind one of my fave songs, which addresses this perfectly! *grin*http://www.reallyrics.com/lyrics/E000600110012.asp
(Cause its fairly long and don't want to spam you :) )
2004-06-27 08:31 pm (UTC)
Great song. Always love it.
Here are the lyrics *I* always think of in such situations:
© 1990 Christine Lavin
He thinks of himself as a victim of love
He's not - He's a volunteer
He has consistently fallen for all the wrong women
Year after year after year
And now he blames every woman who has ever kissed him
Told him that she loved him and later dismissed him
And now he thinks he's a walking victim
He's not - He's a volunteer
She thinks of herself as a victim of circumstance
When she's a volunteer
She has placed her life in the hands of every man
Fool enough to come near
And now she blames anyone who she thinks has used her
Emotionally, or mentally abused her
She's not a victim running from a persecutor
No - She's a volunteer
And he thinks of himself as a victim of fate
When he just volunteers
He has invested his money in well bred astrologers
Healers, Psychic Seers
And now he blames every tilted constellation
Or every negative vibration
He's not a victim of UFO infestation
He's a volunteer
Oh pick the numbers
Shake the sticks
Read the tea leaves
Light the wicks
Point the finger
Pass the buck
Blame it all on lady luck
Do you think of yourself as a victim?
Or do you volunteer?
Do you let somebody else call all of your shots?
Do you cower in the corner in fear?
Or do you follow because it is easy to do?
Do you fool with modern high tech voodoo?
Too bad if you're a victim or whatever you do?
Or do you follow because it is easy to do?
Do you fool with modern high tech voodoo?
Too bad if you're a victim but whatever you do
Why would ya volunteer?
Please don't volunteer!
Yeah, I think that's why it got to me.
This is very true. I've struggled over time to not be a whiny entitlement brat, mainly because there is a point at which one thinks "ok, these bad things happened - get over thyself." It's an absolutely viable thought that, if there are recurrent irritating and/or not-good things going on in your life, then perhaps there's something you can do to make them stop happening, versus allowing yourself to get paralyzed by their occurrence.
Thanks for writing this. It's good to be reminded of.
Everyone has moments. But there is a difference between, say, my whining about how hard it is to get through finals and someone whining that they should have gone to college but didn't and now they are stuck at Burger King and it's too late and there is nothing they can do about it. One is about working through something, the other is just whining.
*clap clap* Well said! May I link to this in my journal for others to read?
Amen to that!
My mom had one of the worst childhoods/upbringings (if you can call it that) of anyone I've ever known and she's also one of the strongest and most positive women I've ever known. She's had problems but she always pushes through them. She stands up for herself and she makes her voice known. And she never uses her past as an excuse. That's one of the things I'm most proud of her for (among many others).
So I second that. Wonderfully put!!
It may not have been for anyone in particular but it did strike a chord with me. i know these things. And i know i am one to dwell on the past. Putting things in my journal though is partly how i try to work through them, get past them, or try to understand.
Compared to Tommy i have indeed been fortunate in life. Some days it's hard to see past the mirror. A lot of that does end up in my journal here. i do try to write about the good things as well. Memories, events, feelings. But my journal only represents a part of me. Still i do "take it to heart." i'm glad you wrote it so i could read it.
Giving you a standing ovation right now, wish you could see! Thank you so very much for putting it out there like that!
Just to say bravo for another superb piece of writing/ranting - sheer brilliance... and (to echo one or two) a right turnon. ~grin~
Woohoo! My brain is sexy! [g]
I know you don't know me, and aren't on my friends list or have me on yours. In all the comments posted in reply to this incredibly well written expression of thought, I only recognize one lj-er. But your words still hit home, rather hard. I now officially feel about 2" tall, and deservedly so. I have finally finished the worst of the mourning process regarding my relationship loss (approx. 6 months ago) and I guarantee if I go back in my LJ, the majority of my posts in the last 6 months were the same thoughts and phrases over and over and over again about said relationship. I'm not happy about the way I handled that situation, not at all, and I know I just should have taken the time, driven to his apartment and had it out with him. This is something I have yet to do, and I know I'm wandering off the subject, so let me get to the point. Your words made me realize something. I can't say exactly what, because even I am not sure yet. But you definitely made me realize something.
So thank you for that.
~ Random Stranger
hey you :)
one thing about you though...you THINK as you write. You aren't just out there bitching, you are realizing schtuff...Ive seen it...
And yup...this post makes one very conscious of what we have, compared to others...and how to deal with things that piss us off, rather than sullenly accept and then vent 24/7....
Yeah...a "Company" referrence there...*hold hand up*
Guilty as charged :)
You've put into words exactly what's been bugging me about one of my friendships in particular, one that I'm not about to let go, but have lately found increasingly frustrating.
I've spent a whole lot of time whining about being trapped and helpless too, although I didn't have an LJ through the worst of it. When someone's in that mindset, they don't WANT anyone to tell them how to help yourself; they just want sympathy and cookies. For me, it went along with clinical depression...I didn't have the emotional energy to get out of the situation I was in, and I didn't see the point.
Fortunately, I'm Much Better Now, and my friend has started taking some proactive measures to better her life as well. But yes, that's a long way of saying I completely agree.
You know, Gini...you have a point. A wonderful point. A sometimes painfully truthful point...and I thank you for it.
I was reading that and noticing that lately, I've fallen into that whiny victim role. It's easy to do...but having read this, I realize that I've got to be proactive. Things won't change til I start the process myself.
Hugs to you, too, darlin'.
I don't know if I've ever said it in writing, but I regard you as one of my heroes. With everything that you've been through, you are still a positive person and you keep fighting. You are incredibly brave, and I salute you.
This was beautifully written. Thank you for sharing it in my journal.
I really have to speak up to you on this one and Im sorry to do so in your journal at such a bad time, but its in reply to your opinion here. Some people post in their journals (me for example) as a way to GET to that healthy point where they can walk forward without, as you say, whining. Their journal is therapy, its a process, its a working-through-the-shit way to get to the moving on.
So my point is? Yes, you and Ferret are in a world of pain because of Tommy. I cant begin to even fathom the depth of his pain. But just because mine, or anyone elses pain isnt the SAME as yours, does not mean that we dont have the right to post it, speak it, or work through it in the way that suits us best.
Frankly, as much as I hate to say it - if you dont want to read it Gini, then you have the right to a) skip it b) skim it c)unfriend the person or any combination of the three and Im certain there are other choices IM not thinking of.
In other words - their journal is theirs. Their pain is their own. What they post is THEIRS. If you dont want it on your reading list, then you have things you can do to fix that.
As for the rest of your belief system you posted here? Compassionate arnt we? Some people just dont have the skills you do, or cant see the paths you can to get where you are. Maybe, if you spoke up with advice or help, instead of bitching about how whiny they are, they might learn from you directly. And if you have, and they are not there yet, then try a little patience. They are not YOU and learn in different ways. Takes time for some people to get to where you are.
I like you, but frankly? You judging others actions AND their own feelings in their OWN journal really pisses me off. Id not even comment if it wasnt for the fact that you dont seem to realize how self centered your own opinion is.
Allow others to be them selves. Let them grow as they can. Some of them suck at it. Some of them need more help. Thats a horrible fact of life. But making fun, juding them, or measuring their pain by your own is selfish and frankly, mean. If it bothers you that bad, why are you reading?
2004-06-28 12:14 am (UTC)
Re: That actually makes me angry
Reread, dearheart. I'm not talking about people who use their journals as a venting place as they are working through things; I'm talking about the people who never get anywhere and never take any responsibility for where they are. Everyone has rough times, and everyone has shit they have to get through, and community is about sharing and growing and trying - and sometimes failing and having people support you. I'm not saying that people shouldn't do that, I'm talking about the ones for whom whining is an end in and of itself, who think the world owes them something, who want everything around them to bend to their whims. You are talking about a very different thing, and not the people at who I am expressing this frustration.
Inaction is not always the result of refusal to get on with one's life. Certainly, life never closes a door without opening a window ... but those who suffer from depression, one of the most common mental illnesses in the world, may actually be unable to perceive it.
When you're depressed -- clinically depressed -- everywhere you turn you find nothing but blank walls. There may be doors, but you never seem to find them; even if you do, they lead only to more dead ends and blind alleys.
It is perhaps cruel that depression is so common, indeed epidemic, because of all mental illnesses it is the hardest to empathize with. It is easy to accept that the schizophrenic is ill when he talks of aliens reading his mind, or that the disassociative is ill when she has sixteen other personalities. But the depressive looks normal, and acts normal, and it's easy to want to slap them, or lecture them that other people have worse problems, or blame them for everything wrong in their lives.
Unfortunately, all of those actions do nothing more than reinforce the condition. Telling a depressed person "Snap out of it, it's up to you to fix your own life" is roughly equivalent to telling a suicidal person that only a worthless loser would want to kill himself.
I was thinking it was like telling a homeless person to get a job.
Yet, I know where she's coming from. However, I don't know if kicking a few butts will help anyone. It's not like people haven't had those thoughts. It's not like people don't know they are foolish. Something holds them back, and I think it's different for each person.
sounds like some people i know. grrrrrrr.
pimped, if you dont mind.